Daily Energy Standup Episode #148 – Biden Administration’s Plan to Ban Gas Furnaces and the Future of Energy News Beat Subscription

The Biden administration is now willing to let you freeze to death in order to proceed with their radical ”climate change” agenda. The upcoming regulations by the government will soon be finalized, imposing severe restrictions […]

Highlights of the Podcast

00:00 – Intro
01:53 – BREAKING: The Biden Administration Is Preparing to Ban Over Half of All Gas Furnaces and Change How Millions Heat Their Homes
09:07 – Paul Graham Introduction and Background
10:47 – Talks about “Thoughts of subscription” for Energy News Beat
13:35 – Michael Talks about Premium Sub stack for Energy News Beat
13:37 – Talks about the changes on the Dashboard of Energy News Beat
16:17 – Talks about thoughts of having an Analyst or additional people to give additional Insights for the Premium Users
17:55 – Talks about Advisory Committee and Adding Contributing Authors
24:16 – Outro

Follow Stuart On LinkedIn and Twitter

Follow Michael On LinkedIn and Twitter

ENB Top News

ENB

Energy Dashboard

ENB Podcast

ENB Substack

Video Transcription edited for grammar. We disavow any errors unless they make us look better or smarter.

Michael Tanner: [00:00:19] What is going on Everybody, Welcome into another edition of the Daily Energy News Beat Stand up here on this gorgeous Tuesday, June 20th, 2023. As always, I’m your humble correspondent, Michael Tanner, coming to you from an undisclosed location here in Dallas, Texas. [00:00:35][15.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:00:35] Stuart Turley is out on assignment he is currently interviewing Dr. Patrick Moore, the former founder of Greenpeace, who has done a complete 180 and is actually standing up against Greenpeace, is actually the process of interviewing him right now so we’re going to give him the night off. [00:00:50][14.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:00:51] So I’m going to rock a solo show I’ve got one article to cover and then a really interesting conversation with Paul Graham, who you guys have heard a few times on this podcast. But before we get to my conversation with Paul, I’d be remiss if I didn’t cover one menu item. [00:01:06][14.7]

Michael Tanner: [00:01:07] Breaking News: The Biden administration is preparing to ban over half of all gas furnaces and will change how millions heat their homes, of course, Stu’s got the doom and gloom stuff, so I will cover that. [00:01:18][11.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:01:18] Markets were actually closed today as well so, I mean, it’s really nothing that’s partly why we’ll talk to Paul here in a bit, guys. But before we do all of that, remember guys, this story and this conversation that you are about to hear is brought to you by the world’s greatest website www.Energynewsbeat.com the best place for all of your Energy News. [00:01:38][19.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:01:39] Stu, who’s again out on assignment does a great job of curating that website to make sure it’s up to date on all of the different energy news. You can hit a set Dashboard.Energynewsbeat.com for all of your data and energy news combo. You can email us [email protected] we love hearing from you guys. [00:01:57][18.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:01:58] But let’s go in here to the first story and really the only story of the of the day. I’ll reiterate the headline Breaking News: The Biden administration is preparing to ban over half of all gas furnaces and change how millions heat their homes. This is a really interesting new proposal out of the Department of Energy. They proposed some new regulations that are really tackling what is known as the Annual Fuel Utilization Efficiency mark, which is more commonly known as the AFUE. [00:02:26][28.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:02:28] Basically what they’re going to require is that this AFUE, which is again the Annual Fuel Utilization Efficiency on all furnaces, must be 95% by 2029, meaning all manufacturers would be allowed to only sell those furnaces that convert at least 90% of the fuel into heat within six years. [00:02:47][19.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:02:48] To give you guys an idea, the current market standard for that AFUE number on a residential furnace is around 80%. So mean, Obviously we need to increase and we need to keep moving towards being more efficient. But this is an absolutely staggering jump because you have to dive into the numbers here. [00:03:07][19.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:03:08] Remember, we always talk about second order effects, Great! Yes, we want to be more fuel efficient. We want to be more energy efficient, we want to use less energy and get more out of it all for that. But what are the second order effects? To give you guys an idea, these new proposals would core would affect about 60% of all residential furnishings currently available on the market and millions of furnaces in already homes. [00:03:31][23.7]

Michael Tanner: [00:03:32] Now, there’s still because this proposal is so fresh, people are still working on how much money, but it’s going to be in the thousands. You’ve got Richard Meier, who’s the vice president of the Energy Market Analysis and Standards for the American Gas Association. His quote was, There’s really technical reasons why this is such a concerning rule, it has to do with the ability for consumers to be in compliance with new efficiency standards. They’re going to have to, in many cases, install new equipment to exhaust gas out of their home. So they’re not really going to become, this isn’t fighting climate change. [00:04:00][28.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:04:00] Remember this? So we’re not saving gas people, we’re going to pump the gas out of the home. So we’re going to put it in the atmosphere, Great! So we’re just we’re not solving climate change, but whatever we’re we’re installing new rules thank you Biden. Let’s get back to the quote, these higher efficiency units or so-called condescending units. [00:04:17][17.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:04:18] A lot of these consumers, which have them in their homes, but most consumers don’t. So this rule would require additional retrofits for a lot of customers. And those retrofits and here’s the kicker can be extremely cost prohibitive. [00:04:30][12.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:04:31] As Stu always says, the consumer takes it in the drive through thats what these rules are about. They’re not all about getting climate change down because we’re just venting this outside now, this is some roundabout kickback to the manufacturing industry, which, hey, I’m all for if the kickbacks end up in my book but in this case they don’t. [00:04:48][17.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:04:49] Again, I mostly tease the issue again with this is much like California’s doing with the EV market. You can’t switch so quickly you have to understand the second order effects. We covered yesterday on our show that there are not and there’s only one EV charging station for every five gas stations and almost none of them are located along major highways that has to change if you’re going to do a massive EV rollout. [00:05:12][23.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:05:13] The issue is we’re expanding and making regulations about the number of EV sales without thinking where are we going to charge these things out. And again, all of the market seems to be flocking to Tesla. So if you like monopolies Yay! We love charging stations at least with gas stations you got multiple different players in the market, so I’ll get a little digress on that topic. [00:05:35][22.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:05:35] But the point of the matter is, guys, Regulations are good, crazy regulations that come in and don’t understand second order effects are bad. And this, in my opinion, is a rule that doesn’t necessarily pass the sniff test. And if you’re going to say, you know, we don’t have money for it. You know, the Porkulus bill, as Stu would call it, doesn’t even include money so that’s the funny part. [00:06:00][25.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:06:01] This isn’t included in the trillions of dollars that they’re sending you know, the trillion dollar budget they’ve got, the billions we’re sending to Ukraine, the hundreds of billions going to Defense Department. But I guarantee there’s nothing in there to actually do this conversion. And remember, what’s the kicker? In many cases, they’re going to have to install equipment to get gas out of their homes. It’s a crime, guys, it’s a crime this isn’t even fighting climate change. [00:06:27][26.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:06:28] So, I mean, again, the consumer takes in the drive thru I could talk all night about this. Markets were closed today so, I mean, pretty simple on that standpoint we’re not really, you know, nothing to really talk about. Oil sits at $71.46. Stu’s not here to scare us for what’s happening. [00:06:46][17.8]

Michael Tanner: [00:06:46] So I will just say that, you know, again, you know, as the U.S. economy goes, so will oil prices. So it’ll be interesting to see how the market opens. I think there is some bullish sentiment so as you listen to this, on Tuesday, you will most likely, in my opinion, be seeing a little bit of an uptick in the markets but again, we will see. [00:07:04][17.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:07:04] I want to kind of turn it over now and to have a conversation with Paul Graham. We had an excellent conversation really regarding, as I’ve been teasing in my intro, this new subscription that we’re rolling out Energy News Beat as you know, our market website, you know, some pretty incredible stuff going on with it right now. And we really wanted to sit down and have a conversation designed around, okay. [00:07:27][22.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:07:28] So what do we think about this subscription? Where’s it going, what that might look like and let you guys, the loyal podcast listeners kind of in on a little in on a little detail that that will be rolling out in the future. So I’m going to go ahead and turn it over that conversation guys. [00:07:41][13.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:08:29] In three, two, one. What’s up, guys? Michael here, sitting with my favorite consiglieri, Paul Graham. This is somebody who is known to the podcast a little bit. We’ve brought him on for his real estate expertise. But really, Paul works in the background here at Sandstone, doing a lot of interesting stuff. [00:08:52][23.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:08:53] And one of those has been really helping and pushing our digital product strategy and digital product go to market strategy specifically because one of the things that we run, as you guys know it is Energynewsbeat.com. For better or worse, it is a product and the goal is to at one point see that in the hands of everybody and trust me, we’ve got plans that go far beyond a simple news website, even though Stu has built this into an absolute machine. [00:09:19][26.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:09:20] I mean, last I checked, would do a 20 to 30000 page views a day all thanks to you guys, the listeners being our core subscribers so we really appreciate it. But really, there’s so much that where there’s so much left and meat on the bone, you know, we’re smoking it. This would only be four or 5 hours into the brisket smoke and raw brisket, smoked steak, 12, 14 hours we’re slow roasting in this. [00:09:45][25.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:09:45] So I want to bring Paul in here a little bit to kind of, again, maybe share a little bit about your background specifically so you can we can kind of prep people and then dive into it just a little bit about what we’re going to do with this Dashboard. And I shouldn’t really call it a Dashboard, really what we’re going to do with this subscription and how we’re really, in my opinion, going to take Energy News Beat to the next level. So set the stage and tell them a little bit about your background. [00:10:08][22.6]

Paul Graham: [00:10:09] Yeah. So I mean, I’ve certainly dabbled in Real Estate one point was a commercial real estate broker helping companies with portfolio office leasing. Now what I fundamentally do is they help companies solve problems, right? That was in that time, you know, with office space or office space in general or investments. And that’s really changed, transitioned into digital products like Michael mentioned. So, you know, we think about podcasts for think about websites, we’re thinking about sales apps, you know, web apps, whole nine yards. [00:10:37][28.4]

Paul Graham: [00:10:38] And so really, as we think about Web products, we also think about the environment that they contain specifically with this user base in energy, it’s important that we can continuously drive value for you, right? This is something that you can use as investment kind of guidance as well as you know, for your professional career and fundamentally, like the decisions that you’re making each day. [00:11:00][22.3]

Paul Graham: [00:11:01] And so we wanted to share, you know, some of the things that we’re thinking about and really looking for feedback from the audience because we really want to give you the pieces to have you really drive home. Fundamentally, it’s really exciting, you know, being able to do things that help people on a day to day basis, right? Make them smile, make them better, and make the world better, too. [00:11:21][20.0]

Paul Graham: [00:11:50] So one thing that is better is also Texas barbecue I just have to say that I had some great brisket today at Terry’s Blacks. I live in Austin if you’re ever looking for some good barbecue, it might be here you might be too opinionated about it that’s okay we can talk about that offline. One thing we can talk about online here and in the description is really this thought of a subscription to, you know, what we have. [00:12:18][27.5]

Paul Graham: [00:12:18] So the first thing is really just the website itself, right? Energy News Beat, giving the ability to have, you know, unlimited access to the Web site. That’s something at this point we want to continue doing. You know, there are some websites out there that do restrict articles that could be something we do for specific articles, you know, that we’ll talk about. [00:12:37][19.1]

Paul Graham: [00:12:38] But the general concept, the Web site, you know, we do want to keep open and wide free to share, discuss and really stew on the Stu on there he’s gonna be proud. The other thing is we especially look at, you know, the podcast itself. You know, we do have ads in this podcast for, you know, our livelihood and our then ability to help grow, you know, this platform and our employee base and our impact as well. And you help support that. [00:13:11][32.7]

Paul Graham: [00:13:11] So through, you know, listening to ads or potentially paying for a elimination of ads, you know, would be advantageous really for you in your time. Although we do have, you know, some great sponsors who are worth your time to listen to and, you know, really understand if they could be a fit for you right?. Again, we want to do this in your best interest, not drive for dollars, if you will. So those are to some exciting things but Michael, you want to hear more about the kind of thought of Stu doing a substack or an article that would not be posted on Substack? [00:13:49][37.8]

Michael Tanner: [00:13:50] Yeah. So, you know, I think, you know, rolling out these subscriptions will be great I think one thing Paul’s given us clarity on is and is really driving home is okay, what is the experience feel like for a user I mean when you. Well, if you’re going to subscribe to something, what value to get from it and what’s the experience like when you get that? [00:14:11][20.4]

Michael Tanner: [00:14:11] So what we’ve really attempted to put together is, is an offer stack that I think there’s a really good job of giving everybody value. I mean, we’re not, you know, I think to answer that before we get in, ask to answer the first question, we’ve got no idea what we’re charging for this. This is something that we’re we’re actively working on you know, this is a little bit of a new concept we’re trying to say. This is where our minds headed kind of behind the scenes onto the process. [00:14:35][24.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:14:36] None of the stuff that we’re about to cover here is like exactly what’s going to be in the offer stack. Things are going to change, things are obviously going to be different it’s partly why we want your feedback. If you hit the description below, you should be able to find a link to a HubSpot form that’ll, you know, get you in contact with us to go ahead and fill that out. I’ll mention this at the end of the podcast as well. [00:14:57][20.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:14:58] But, you know, I think the first thing that we’re going to offer in this podcast, as Paul mentioned, is an article that is sort of what I would call kind of a premium substack article. So the idea of substack is, oh, you can put stuff behind a paywall, you cannot put stuff behind a paywall. But the idea of a substack when you hear substack, it’s a newsletter. [00:15:21][23.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:15:22] And so what’s going to do is he’s going to write a custom newsletter article that’s going to go behind a paywall that can be available on Substack it’s not going to be available without logging in and going to our little premium homepage that we’re going to roll out and that’s going to be critical. [00:15:37][14.9]

Michael Tanner: [00:15:37] Because as you guys know, if your, you know, your podcast listeners, you know that Stu take is the best, in my opinion, in the world at taking complicated, diverse and different interests and showing you how they weave together and how one impacts the other. Truly, how a rice farmer in China affects a stock trader in New York he truly understands and can make those connections. So that’s one of the probably the, that’s a huge value add that you’re going to get. [00:16:05][28.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:17:05] So the next thing that I think you’re going to see specifically is the Dashboard, which I think is cool. It’s something that we’ve got multiple versions of. I think there are some people who have seen V1 if you go to Dashboard.Energynewsbeat.com, you can see the one we’ve got available for previewing our V2. that’s mainly just a UI version we’re working on a bunch of back end stuff. [00:17:31][26.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:17:32] And that’s something that Paul has driven really be updating, he led kind of that original development on V1 he’s worked really hard to get V2 spun up, and to be honest V2 looks great. Where can people view that UI Paul? Is that that description below? Where can they see it? [00:17:49][16.7]

Paul Graham: [00:17:50] Yeah. So let’s just keep things simple, you know, for users and reach out, you know, within the description to get, you know, access to that and see that, you know, on our main page we’ll be updating that Dashboard link Michael mentioned so you are able to see that. [00:18:05][15.9]

Paul Graham: [00:18:07] And you’ll then just need to provide some credentials so for example, email for us to send you more information about it, but this would be the quickest way for you to get access to see the description in this show to then, you know, for see and what we have cookin with a Dashboard that’s specific to, you know, energy, right. Related to the news and data that you care about to again help you with your day to day, you know, whatever that might be in the industry space. So, you know, it’s an exciting thing. [00:18:41][34.4]

Paul Graham: [00:18:42] One other exciting thing that, you know, we’ve really dreamed of and thought about is the thought of having access to, you know, kind of analysts or additional people to give you additional insight. Michael, I mean, you’re probably the best to to talk about this what have we kind of thought about here? [00:19:01][19.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:02] So this is another thing that I’m hot on I think maybe Puzzle hasn’t drawn because I agree with some of his his points. But if you’re familiar at all with like real time new what they call new squawk services or squawk services there’s you’ve got news squawk ran squawk is one of them I think they’ve merged. You’ve got TT trade there’s a few more out there. But all of them, what they do is they offer an ability for you to message an analyst and they get a response back. [00:19:29][27.3]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:30] I firmly believe at some point that will make this part of the offer. Is that going to be a real time? You submit a question 5 minutes later, you get my response. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Now, is it going to be you email me a question we get back to you within 48 hours. And if you pay for a really nice premium level you get, the more you pay, the quicker response time. Yeah, that’s probably what it’s going to look like. [00:19:55][24.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:19:55] But I definitely think giving access to not just me but our entire analyst team. When you talk about Paul with real estate still with geopolitics and the other people in the sandstone ecosystem, oh, that’s extremely valuable and I think having something like that will definitely make it. [00:20:13][17.7]

Michael Tanner: [00:20:13] Now, will it make it in this original roll out? I don’t know there’s some details to work out. I think the most interesting part and the most interesting, I would say tack on to this is something that, again, not to toot Paul’s own horn that he’s pushed, he’s talked about a bunch. I was originally against it and now I’m for and it’s the idea of and not and I’m going to go out on a limb here, Paul and we’re going to. [00:20:38][25.1]

Paul Graham: [00:20:38] See the Advisory Committee. [00:20:39][0.6]

Michael Tanner: [00:20:39] I’m going to say the Advisory Committee and I want you to talk specifically about that, because this has been your baby you’ve pushed me on it and I’m there I think it’s a great idea. [00:20:47][8.0]

Paul Graham: [00:20:48] Yeah. So it’s just continuing this out of the analyst piece so it’s just to say, hey, like what kind of augmented information and or resource could you as a professional or you, you know, managing running a team or even a company, right. If you’re executive CEO, could you have at your disposal in some sort of cadence so that way you can be a market leader, right? [00:21:09][21.5]

Paul Graham: [00:21:10] I’ve seen this in real estate. I’ve also seen this in general, you know, topics related and and really the opportunity to have kind of a meeting of the minds advisory committee of individuals who bring, you know, unique perspective within the energy space to have conversations about what they are doing or what they’re thinking could happen where I’ve seen this specifically used, particularly that I can actually talk about without any NDA conflicts is, you know, COVID of which, you know, there were some companies who did massive layoffs, whether that’s, you know, the right, the wrong thing, we won’t get there. [00:21:45][35.0]

Paul Graham: [00:21:45] But I had the specific experience of having this sort of advisory committee that then was able to take a different lens to say, hey, we’re going to cut executive pay 20%. We’re going to, you know, sunset, you know, this group and do layoffs for kind of trimming, you know, some operational inefficiencies because growth halted and then also reduce general pay by 10%. right? [00:22:11][25.6]

Paul Graham: [00:22:12] Keeping morale relatively intact and stabilized and then continuing to grow right? Great experience all around in comparison to others that then just have lost their job. Yes. Severance, you know, does mighty wonders to a point right? There’s still that, you know, extreme emotional toll, if you will. [00:22:28][16.6]

Paul Graham: [00:22:29] And so that advisory committee was, in my opinion, able to, you know, have a better trajectory than other organizations that might not have been aware of that potential or didn’t know how to piece that together. Right. [00:22:42][12.3]

Paul Graham: [00:22:42] For different individuals that have different career experiences, this could be then an opportunity for, you know, the executive who’s been in the space five years versus the one that’s in, you know, 50 to then come back and say, hey, you know, this is kind of some things to to think about and then, you know, continue to give value both ways, right? So that sort of opportunity is something, you know, we would love to explore and have opinions on, you know, both good, bad and indifferent to understand, you know, how we can really take this community and bring it more alive. Right. [00:23:15][32.1]

Paul Graham: [00:23:15] So you’re listening to this, how can we feel this community more? How can we see this community more? How can we interact as well? And those things can, again, really transcend the value that we bring to you beyond listening, just to Michael Tanner’s voice from an undisclosed location in Dallas, Texas although great. [00:23:36][20.8]

Paul Graham: [00:23:38] So the other thing we’ve been thinking about has been, you know, adding contributing authors. So this would just be an opportunity to have more individuals come into kind of the fold to allow, you know, really just different sort of research and perspective to, again, give value what this could look like, feel like sound like, you know, really kind of fleshing that out. This, at least in my personal opinion, wouldn’t be something that you would need to pay for to come into the fold but this is certainly going to be a vetting process. [00:24:14][36.4]

Paul Graham: [00:24:16] This isn’t everyone, you know, gets a piece of paper and a pen to write something on. This is a true value-driven, you know, piece and an opportunity that we have for individuals who, you know, want to share their thought leadership sort of perspective really, on that. Mike, I’ll let you kind of finish the last point on, you know, podcast and, you know, any special pieces for, you know, if there are any early releases or what that could maybe look like for people that, you know, just can’t get enough of us and then want a little more. [00:24:49][33.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:24:50] I can’t get enough of myself, so don’t worry about that. No, I think, you know, I definitely think what we’re going to we’re going to get an ad free version of the podcast as well. We do a lot of, you know, we’re going to start increasing the amount of ads you hear. You know, Aandy’s not cheap over there so I got a you got to make sure that the bills are paid. [00:25:15][25.1]

Michael Tanner: [00:25:16] But No you do an ad free version of the podcast. But no, I think I think we’ve done a good job and and hopefully you you going to get a better idea of where our mindset with this subscription what the value prop is. [00:25:26][10.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:25:26] Again, hit the description below there’s going to be a link there that allows you to get in contact with us and we’re going to we can walk you through everything, see what you want, see what you don’t want, and ultimately get you better access. Because again, this is rolling out it’s like a choo choo train coming. It’s coming and we want you on that train, baby, because it’s coming. Any last words, Paul? [00:25:47][20.5]

Michael Tanner: [00:25:48] No, I think that’s it. We’ll have everything in the description make it nice and easy again with love, feedback, you know, positive opinions right. Because this is for you and the value that we do for you we do this for you and really want to hear, you know what? What that is, because there’s certainly a unique opportunity here to give to our listeners to allow them to do the things they want to do and learn the things that they were, you know, unaware of. [00:26:16][28.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:26:18] Yeah. And if you want to call and complain about Stu, I’m down. I’ll give you my personal cell phone number to do that. But you got to first see this in the description below, and then I’ll give that, Just kidding. [00:26:26][8.5]

Paul Graham: [00:26:28] Maybe we might release that as a paid feature we’ll see. [00:26:32][4.0]

Michael Tanner: [00:26:32] Maybe you release that so, Aight guys hey we appreciate it! Paul, thanks for sticking around and we’ll get it going Energy News Beat. Hurrah! [00:26:39][6.6]

Paul Graham: [00:26:40] Till next time. [00:26:41][0.2]

Michael Tanner: [00:26:41] Well, see you Tomorrow! [00:26:41][0.0]